• JackGreenEarth@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    32
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    You can’t describe qualia (at all, including color), but you can explain how different wavelengths are perceived by the eye and compare it to wavelengths of sound.

    • dope@lemm.eeOP
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      10
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      Qualia eh? I was calling them “sensations”. Thanks for the word.

      I suppose you can’t describe any sensation/qualia. You can only refer to other sensations (in memory or with words or etc) and say “it’s like that”.

    • dope@lemm.eeOP
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      8
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      I would say, “It’s the same color as that thing over there”.

  • fubo@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    12
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Color is maybe more like sound than it is like texture, pressure, temperature, or scent/taste; but it doesn’t usually have echoes or beats like sound does, and people who see can perceive lots of different colors at the same time on different objects in view.

    One element of color is brightness. If you’ve felt sunlight and shadow on your skin, well, brightness is a lot like that. People who see use brightness and shadow to tell a lot about shapes of things, because things that are illuminated by light cast a shadow.

    Another element of color is hue. If you’ve studied physics, you’ve encountered the idea of electromagnetic waves having frequencies, which is the same as photons carrying different amounts of energy. Hue is (mostly) just those frequencies, within the specific band that eyes can see. Paints and dyes affect which hues a surface reflects, because those chemicals resonate with those frequencies.

      • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        This is a FASCINATING topic. Anything relating to qualia, honestly, is. My understanding on a blind person seeing color under hallucinagens is, it’d depend on why they’re blind. If it’s something with the eye or optic nerve, then the brain, the thing that actually MAKES the color, should still be able to produce them, but if that area of the brain is damaged, then it’d be a lot less likely for them to see any color.

        Also consider, if they do see color, but have never seen the world before, they won’t have any way to map color to object. So they may see a stop sign (or their interpretation of it, more like) and it may be in color, but essentially random. Now how do we know two people’s ‘red’ is the same color? All of this is absolutely fascinating to me.

        • dope@lemm.eeOP
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          One model of reality says that all sensations share a common root. If you could speak in terms of that root then maybe you could describe color to a blind man. You could probably describe a whole bunch of other strange things too.

    • Albbi@lemmy.ca
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      I saw that movie only one time as a kid and still remember that scene. Love it.

    • Ixoid@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      I came here looking to see if my point had already been made. Thanks!

  • MolochAlter@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    7
    ·
    1 year ago

    I’d compare them to musical notes I guess?

    Loudness = brightness, color = note seems accurate enough to explain it.

  • ohlaph@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    6
    ·
    1 year ago

    You would have to understand the person. Some might think in math, others in musical notes, others in temperature, and others in taste. You would probably have to understand how they think in order to relate an unknown topic such as color.

  • peto (he/him)@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    6
    ·
    1 year ago

    In such a way that they understand what you are talking about like I would? Might not be possible.

    Look up Mary’s Room for some more thinking into this subject.

  • morgan423@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    5
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    You can’t really describe colors to someone blind from birth. They just have no reference or mechanical ability to be able to see it.

    Someone below linked a Tommy Edison video (it’s a good watch, as is pretty much everything on his entire channel) where he talks about how people have tried to describe color to him all his life, but nothing they’ve said has ever actually made him see a color. He doesn’t see anything, he doesn’t have a working optic nerve.

  • ekky43@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    2
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Like hearing multiple octals at the same time, when you’ve only ever heard one?

    Like feeling cold and hot, when you’ve only ever felt uncomfort?

    Like tasting sour and sweet, when you’ve only ever tasted bitter?

    Like going to the country and smelling nature, when you’ve only ever smelt the smog of the city?

    EDIT: no wait, that’s for someone who is partially blind, don’t think it works for someone who has never perceived sight.