Have you watch TOS and try to actually watch it without the lense of nostalgia? The episodic format makes it easier to focus on the absolute classics and ignore some of the worst episodes of Star Trek ever, but the average quality is not above modern Star Trek shows.
If we’re talking the 90s-era though I think it changes completely. And those would be better to use as a reference. It’s also what a lot of people mean these days when they say Oldtrek.
TOS’ quality drops off in the third season, but those first two years are almost all bangers. TNG era shows have a similar ratio, it’s just reversed: they struggle at the start, and pick up as they go.
I like TOS. My favorite is DS9, followed closely by TNG (even if I find half the characters annoying… but I find most of them annoying because that’s their characterization. Ryker is a womanizer chasing skirts. But he’s a well written one, for the most part.)
None of them are perfect and I never said they were.
Nutrek (post abramsverse for me,) has focused more on glitz than substance. Doesn’t change that in my opinion, DIS makes more sense if you assume they’re tripping balls rather than actually going anywhere.
It felt rather more like they tried to hamfist a fucked up and ill fated love affair between two people with equally hamfisted backgrounds, without any real regard for the trek canon, and especially already-established characters.
Their response to the early criticisms weren’t to actually improve the writing, but rather jump forward so far out of established canon they could continue to write poorly, and left Tyler behind to resolve that mistake.
Virtually every show in existence has dud episodes. Even the greatest shows ever made. They happen. What’s your point?
I get that you liked it. That’s fair. You can like things and disagree with me. Thats totally cool (not that you need my permission or anything.)
As for “the canon”, you know that every show and movie made before DIS is canon, right? Not just TOS, but the motion picture, tng, ent, ds9, voyager. And now DIS is also sadly part of that canon (though I suspect they’re going to just memory hole it… Klingons are back to normal in SNW, for example.)
That’s how that works. When you come into a franchise that’s as heavily established as Trek, with as dedicated a fan base, you have to at least respect existing canon, and make sure any retcons to it make sense or expand on something without totally trashing things.
Costume designers, for example, come in a decide that, no, Klingons, really need to be *completely reworked into an unrecognizable species that stands a few feet taller, has giant, bald-lizard heads and we’re gaudy, pokey armor…. Is just gonna piss off a lot of existing fans. (Only fan base more, uh, passionate is Star Wars. They’re savages.)
Have you watch TOS and try to actually watch it without the lense of nostalgia? The episodic format makes it easier to focus on the absolute classics and ignore some of the worst episodes of Star Trek ever, but the average quality is not above modern Star Trek shows.
I agree.
If we’re talking the 90s-era though I think it changes completely. And those would be better to use as a reference. It’s also what a lot of people mean these days when they say Oldtrek.
TOS’ quality drops off in the third season, but those first two years are almost all bangers. TNG era shows have a similar ratio, it’s just reversed: they struggle at the start, and pick up as they go.
Yes.
I like TOS. My favorite is DS9, followed closely by TNG (even if I find half the characters annoying… but I find most of them annoying because that’s their characterization. Ryker is a womanizer chasing skirts. But he’s a well written one, for the most part.)
None of them are perfect and I never said they were.
Nutrek (post abramsverse for me,) has focused more on glitz than substance. Doesn’t change that in my opinion, DIS makes more sense if you assume they’re tripping balls rather than actually going anywhere.
It felt rather more like they tried to hamfist a fucked up and ill fated love affair between two people with equally hamfisted backgrounds, without any real regard for the trek canon, and especially already-established characters.
Their response to the early criticisms weren’t to actually improve the writing, but rather jump forward so far out of established canon they could continue to write poorly, and left Tyler behind to resolve that mistake.
What substance is there on “Spock’s Brain”, “Turnabout Intruder” or “The Way to Eden”?
And what established canon? TOS is all over the place too, from the laws and organisation of the federation to the nature of Vulcans.
/sigh.
Virtually every show in existence has dud episodes. Even the greatest shows ever made. They happen. What’s your point?
I get that you liked it. That’s fair. You can like things and disagree with me. Thats totally cool (not that you need my permission or anything.)
As for “the canon”, you know that every show and movie made before DIS is canon, right? Not just TOS, but the motion picture, tng, ent, ds9, voyager. And now DIS is also sadly part of that canon (though I suspect they’re going to just memory hole it… Klingons are back to normal in SNW, for example.)
That’s how that works. When you come into a franchise that’s as heavily established as Trek, with as dedicated a fan base, you have to at least respect existing canon, and make sure any retcons to it make sense or expand on something without totally trashing things.
Costume designers, for example, come in a decide that, no, Klingons, really need to be *completely reworked into an unrecognizable species that stands a few feet taller, has giant, bald-lizard heads and we’re gaudy, pokey armor…. Is just gonna piss off a lot of existing fans. (Only fan base more, uh, passionate is Star Wars. They’re savages.)