Yesterday I was reading the post about the FUTO keyboard where there were a lot of messages deleted by moderators.
I’ve commented there

What the heck happened with all the messages deleted by moderator?

And it got deleted. Right now you can only see 4, but I’ve counted 19 messages moderated and the post has been locked. Why?
I’ve had a look ad the modlog and the messages don’t seems to violate any policy (now they’ve removed them in the modlog too).

I’m pinging here lemmy.ml admin and the mods of the open source community where the post was posted so they can have their say about it and clarify the situation to me.
@[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected]

If I’m getting something wrong, please let me know, I’m here to discus and understand if I’m getting something wrong or if something went wrong in the moderation. Thanks!

Down here you can see the deleted comments.

P.s. I’m writing here because I think that this post on lemmy.ml wouldn’t last long.

  • PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat
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    8 hours ago

    I would submit that even if it is misinformation and people are climbing all over the comments claiming that FUTO is definitely open source, removing the comments to leave only the remnant of it that is “truth” is often not the best way to handle it. The majority of the removed comments didn’t seem like they were saying that, some even specifically said that FUTO isn’t open source but blah blah blah, but even if so, here’s my feeling:

    The way the conversation looks right now is just confusing. There are people who have no idea about FUTO who have the feeling that they’re just not allowed to talk about it, or to say true statements (for example, whatever you think of their license, they fund real open-source projects.) Because FUTO is officially “bad” and they might get banned or something for wanting to talk about it or ask questions. It actually doesn’t look to me like people are coming in primarily to evangelize. But regardless of that, my personal feeling is, you have to let people talk.

    I feel like if there was a sticky comment from a mod / admin at the top of the comments, something like PSA: FUTO is not open source. The people that are claiming it is, are wrong, with respect to long-established definitions. (link) (link), then that would be fine. People can see the arguments, and presumably there’s enough respect in place for the “leaders” of the community that they’ll give a lot of weight to the sticky comment. But they still have the sense that they’re allowed to talk about it and think about it on their own instead of being ordered to receive the correct interpretations from above, when they don’t even have their bearings as far as what’s even being talked about.

    I’m not secretive about my strong disagreements with a lot of lemmy.ml moderation philosophy. I’m just making an effort, here, to explain why I have such a strong disagreement in a productive fashion, instead of just hectoring or being combative about it.

    • Arthur Besse@lemmy.ml
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      6 hours ago

      removing the comments to leave only the remnant of it that is “truth” is often not the best way to handle it

      i totally agree that it is often preferable to allow misinformed comments to remain so that they can be refuted.

      in the case of futo, though, i feel like there are often actually some bad-faith actors who just want to keep the discussion going, and will continue to repeat their misinformed arguments in the face of any and all evidence.

      and, in this particular case, it is even a thread in the Open Source community so any discussion of Futo is inherently offtopic. (and all of which is also effectively promotion for them; again see succès de scandale.)

      The way the conversation looks right now is just confusing

      the thread as it is now has lots of comments about open source keyboards, and a link to this thread for anyone who wants more information about all the deleted comments than they can find in the modlog. if you think it would be better if that thread was still mostly people arguing about Futo… well… i’m glad you’re not a mod there.

      • PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat
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        5 hours ago

        Oh, no, I was talking purely about the second post, about FUTO itself. I agree about protecting the first post, about open source keyboards, against being overshadowed by a big argument about FUTO which isn’t an open source keyboard.

        • Arthur Besse@lemmy.ml
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          4 hours ago

          Oh, no, I was talking purely about the second post, about FUTO itself

          Oh. Well, that post I sort of figured I should just delete altogether (because it is also offtopic there, and bad publicity is still benefiting futo) but I left it locked in hopes that it would discourage more of the same.